Bush visits Iraq to say 'Goodbye' and has shoes thrown at him

Post by **Oscar Namechange** » Sun Dec 14, 2008 12:27 pm

George Bush makes surprise farewell visit to Iraq - Telegraph

qsducks · Post by **qsducks** » Sun Dec 14, 2008 12:43 pm

I'd like to throw more than shoes at that butthead!:wah:

Post by **Oscar Namechange** » Sun Dec 14, 2008 1:35 pm

jimbo;1086261 wrote: its all cobblers

they are hoping heel never come back

not toe day not toe morrow

now he has been booted out of office

he will stilleto bahma carry on :yh_rotfl:yh_rotfl

any more

This is a serious thread about the blatent disrespect shown to a world leader in a hostile country.

Chookie · Post by **Chookie** » Sun Dec 14, 2008 1:50 pm

oscar;1086267 wrote: This is a serious thread about the blatent disrespect shown to a world leader in a hostile country.

No its not. Its about due respect shown to a war criminal.

Post by **Oscar Namechange** » Sun Dec 14, 2008 2:10 pm

And Oscar scores another vital point over Jimbo and Chookyness

Had you going again didn't i jimbo??

You really can't see them coming can you?

:yh_rotfl:yh_rotfl:yh_rotfl:yh_rotfl

flopstock · Post by **flopstock** » Sun Dec 14, 2008 3:49 pm

fuzzy butt;1086245 wrote: thankyou for my first laugh of the day :wah: I hope the journo doesn't get into too much trouble:o

You're joking right? If they hold free elections, you are looking at their next leader...:yh_rotfl:yh_rotfl

Post by **Oscar Namechange** » Sun Dec 14, 2008 3:56 pm

Why am i the only one who thinks this is really bad?

It doesn't matter who is or who is to blame for the Iraq war.. This is a world leader being assaulted!!!!!!

If they get away with it, it's the green light for any one to take out their own ideals on any world leader. with so many world leaders visiting forign countrie's, we just can't have that sort of thing. Bush was assaulted!!!!!

flopstock · Post by **flopstock** » Sun Dec 14, 2008 4:08 pm

If I was a guy throwing shoes and there was any chance they were reporting the size... I'd borrow some size 16s, I think..

along-for-the-ride · Post by **along-for-the-ride** » Sun Dec 14, 2008 4:08 pm

I did read in the article that throwing a shoe at somebody is the ultimite insult in that country. Bush, for all his imperfections, is currently our country's President...atleast for a few more weeks. I agree with oscar on this one. The office of the Presidency should be treated with respect. (As with other world leaders visiting our country.) This incident should not be trivialized.

My fear is that, in the future, there is someone out there who may want to throw more than a shoe at our President-Elect. For some "offence" of their choosing.

Post by **Oscar Namechange** » Sun Dec 14, 2008 4:28 pm

along-for-the-ride;1086355 wrote: I did read in the article that throwing a shoe at somebody is the ultimite insult in that country. Bush, for all his imperfections, is currently our country's President...atleast for a few more weeks. I agree with oscar on this one. The office of the Presidency should be treated with respect. (As with other world leaders visiting our country.) This incident should not be trivialized.

My fear is that, in the future, there is someone out there who may want to throw more than a shoe at our President-Elect. For some "offence" of their choosing.

Thankyou Flopstock for saying so well what i tried to.

It's like one kid throw a stone at your house and next week, ten of his mates join him with rocks.

I do hope they get tough on the Journalist.

We have to remember that any world leader is a world leader because their country voted for them. We don't treat foriegn nationals like it and i don't see why anyone thinks it's Ok because it's Bush.

Can you imagine the up-roar if it was the elected President of Iraq who got the same treatment in America or Britain. If it were here, I'd be ashamed.

flopstock · Post by **flopstock** » Sun Dec 14, 2008 4:33 pm

along-for-the-ride;1086355 wrote: I did read in the article that throwing a shoe at somebody is the ultimite insult in that country. Bush, for all his imperfections, is currently our country's President...atleast for a few more weeks. I agree with oscar on this one. The office of the Presidency should be treated with respect. (As with other world leaders visiting our country.) This incident should not be trivialized.

My fear is that, in the future, there is someone out there who may want to throw more than a shoe at our President-Elect. For some "offence" of their choosing.

Can you imagine that same journalist daring to protest like that under the old regime? Bush's actions gave him the right and the freedom to throw those shoes. Maybe that's what our world leaders need.. quit listening to your pollsters and consider instead how many shoes you've had to dodge lately.

A gun, a grenade, a knife - broken glass even.. I'd be upset. The guy had the balls to take his shoes off and throw them at a head of state in disgust... I admire his spontanious protest. I would imagine he was kept as in the dark as the US journalists were, concerning events he would be covering.

flopstock · Post by **flopstock** » Sun Dec 14, 2008 4:34 pm

oscar;1086364 wrote: Thankyou Flopstock for saying so well what i tried to.

It's like one kid throw a stone at your house and next week, ten of his mates join him with rocks.

I do hope they get tough on the Journalist.

We have to remember that any world leader is a world leader because their country voted for them. We don't treat foriegn nationals like it and i don't see why anyone thinks it's Ok because it's Bush.

Can you imagine the up-roar if it was the elected President of Iraq who got the same treatment in America or Britain. If it were here, I'd be ashamed.

that wasn't me, that was along for the ride..

me, i thought it was funny.. sorry..:wah:

cars · Post by **cars** » Sun Dec 14, 2008 4:41 pm

What AFTR said!!!

Post by **spot** » Sun Dec 14, 2008 4:55 pm

It indicates the President's ignorance of local customs that he could say "So what if he threw a shoe at me".

The journalist, incidentally, has so far not been seen or spoken with by any of his colleagues or family. He would seem to be in the hands of the occupation forces.

Post by **Oscar Namechange** » Sun Dec 14, 2008 5:19 pm

spot;1086379 wrote: It indicates the President's ignorance of local customs that he could say "So what if he threw a shoe at me".

The journalist, incidentally, has so far not been seen or spoken with by any of his colleagues or family. He would seem to be in the hands of the occupation forces.

It does show his ignorance. Even i, if in my muslim friend's home's or work place have to remember not to sit with my feet up and with feet facing them. In the kitchens, if i handle Ham, i have to remember to wash my hands before making them tea. If's an understanding of other's culture's and Bush seems to be ignorant here.

However, i don't condone the journalist one bit.

wildhorses · Post by **wildhorses** » Sun Dec 14, 2008 6:48 pm

This is fk'n funny. When I woke up this morning....I turned on the radio and it just happened to be this news report. I laughed so hard. Great way to wake up.

wildhorses · Post by **wildhorses** » Sun Dec 14, 2008 11:43 pm

oscar;1086348 wrote: Why am i the only one who thinks this is really bad?

It doesn't matter who is or who is to blame for the Iraq war.. This is a world leader being assaulted!!!!!!

If they get away with it, it's the green light for any one to take out their own ideals on any world leader. with so many world leaders visiting forign countrie's, we just can't have that sort of thing. Bush was assaulted!!!!!

You make a good point. I dont really think its funny per se...but the visual picture....sorry I have to laugh.

Post by **Oscar Namechange** » Mon Dec 15, 2008 6:44 am

fuzzy butt;1086607 wrote: Okay this is effing ridiculas could I call in others please to certify that my comment is a satirical joke?

Big Foot!! If big foot wore shoes? they'd be really big shoes . He wouldn't want them thrown at him!!!!

christ!!!!!! why the hell am I dissecting a bloody joke?

Are you seriously that slow Jester?

It was a joke and not an anti-american statement of course.

I think we are all becoming too sensitive here. Big foot, is a joke not anti American.

It was not even a staement as to the shoe thrower being right or wrong.

Jesus, you want to see what gmc and gallbladder say about my PM, and that's why if they are at the FG meet in London, they are going to get punched!!

My only critism of Bush here is that he said 'hey, the guy threw a shoe at me, so what?'

He should have done what our government did when germany had the gall to critisize my Pm in the EU summit this week.

I still feel that any world leader deserve's respect when abroad. Iraq is forgetting who funded them for years!!

Post by **spot** » Mon Dec 15, 2008 8:53 am

Still no sign of the chap.An Iraqi official was quoted by the Associated Press as saying that the journalist was being interrogated to determine whether anybody paid him to throw his shoes at President Bush. He was also being tested for alcohol and drugs, and his shoes were being held as evidence, said the official, speaking on condition of anonymity.

The Cairo-based al-Baghdadiya TV channel said Mr Zaidi should be freed because he had been exercising freedom of expression - something which the Americans had promised to Iraqis on the ousting of former Iraqi leader Saddam Hussein. "Any measures against Muntadar will be considered the acts of a dictatorial regime," the firm said in a statement. The programming director for al-Baghdadiya, Muzhir al-Khafaji, described the journalist as a "proud Arab and an open-minded man".

He said he was afraid for Mr Zaidi's safety, adding that the reporter had been arrested by US officials twice before.

BBC NEWS | World | Middle East | Iraq rally for Bush shoe attacker

mikeinie · Post by **mikeinie** » Mon Dec 15, 2008 11:11 am

What a great duck for an old guy though! Well done Mr. Pres :yh_worshp

And I love the other guy, he barely even moved or blinked an eye .:wah:

Post by **spot** » Tue Dec 16, 2008 4:50 am

This is just plain shameful. Bad cess to them all, how can anyone support this sort of disgusting behaviour?The brother of the Iraqi journalist who threw his shoes at US President George W Bush has said that the reporter has been beaten in custody. Muntadar al-Zaidi has suffered a broken hand, broken ribs and internal bleeding, as well as an eye injury, his older brother, Dargham, told the BBC.

[...] Mr Zaidi told our correspondent that despite offers from many lawyers his brother has not been given access to any since being arrested by forces under the command of Mowaffaq al-Rubaie, Iraq's national security adviser.

BBC NEWS | World | Middle East | Shoe thrower 'beaten in custody'

Post by **Oscar Namechange** » Tue Dec 16, 2008 8:46 am

spot;1087396 wrote: This is just plain shameful. Bad cess to them all, how can anyone support this sort of disgusting behaviour?The brother of the Iraqi journalist who threw his shoes at US President George W Bush has said that the reporter has been beaten in custody. Muntadar al-Zaidi has suffered a broken hand, broken ribs and internal bleeding, as well as an eye injury, his older brother, Dargham, told the BBC.

[...] Mr Zaidi told our correspondent that despite offers from many lawyers his brother has not been given access to any since being arrested by forces under the command of Mowaffaq al-Rubaie, Iraq's national security adviser.

BBC NEWS | World | Middle East | Shoe thrower 'beaten in custody'

I can see what was probably just a spontaneous action on the part of the journalist, escallating rapidly.

I have a sense of fore-boding here and think it's about to get worse.

I do not agree with what the journalist did bar far, but he should be charged within a court of law not like this.

Post by **spot** » Tue Dec 16, 2008 11:03 am

oscar;1087574 wrote: I can see what was probably just a spontaneous action on the part of the journalist, escallating rapidly.

I have a sense of fore-boding here and think it's about to get worse.

I do not agree with what the journalist did bar far, but he should be charged within a court of law not like this.

If the Bush White House has spent four thousand US lives to exchange one bunch of Iraqi leaders who were above the law for another bunch of Iraqi leaders who are above the law one wonders where the value lies.

Post by **Peter Lake** » Tue Dec 16, 2008 11:08 am

spot;1087631 wrote: If the Bush White House has spent four thousand US lives to exchange one bunch of Iraqi leaders who were above the law for another bunch of Iraqi leaders who are above the law one wonders where the value lies.

In this instance, more of the same i feel.

There is the possibility, that the Iraq leaders will come down hard on the journalist to make an example and to deter further such incidents. It's a no win situation. Too soft, the world laughs, too tough, back to the old regime of their predecessors.

Post by **Oscar Namechange** » Wed Dec 17, 2008 4:45 pm

George Bush shoe-thrower Muntazer al-Zaidi 'too severely beaten' for court appearance | World news | guardian.co.uk

Post by **spot** » Fri Dec 19, 2008 3:27 am

A simple question could be put at this point. Would the guy who publicly insulted George Bush write "a contrite letter" to the US stooge running Iraq unless he was under pressure in custody? There's an element of mockery in the judge refusing him bail "for his own safety". Nobody can deny that Muntader al-Zaidi is a brave man or that he'd have known these outrageous consequences would inevitably follow. He should be released immediately. Disrupting a press conference in those circumstances and in that symbolic way is a public duty, not a crime.Yasin Majeed said Mr Maliki had received a contrite letter from the journalist. "Zaidi said in his letter that his big ugly act cannot be excused," Mr Majeed said. He said Mr Zaidi added: "But I remember in the summer of 2005, I interviewed your excellency and you told me, 'Come in, this is your house'. And so I appeal to your fatherly feelings to forgive me."

BBC NEWS | World | Middle East | Iraqi shoe-thrower 'apologises'

mikeinie · Post by **mikeinie** » Fri Dec 19, 2008 5:01 am

Never mind the fact for the moment that it was Bush, a world leader was addressing the press with their own country’s leader.

The press was invited as guests; this guy abused his position as a journalist with access to world leaders to voice his discontent. This is not a public place or open forum. It was rude and inexcusable.

As far a punishment, whatever the standard is for this kind of thing (if there is one) should be applied. I think that at this point he should be released with all journalistic privileges revoked.

Post by **spot** » Fri Dec 19, 2008 5:16 am

mikeinie;1089481 wrote: As far a punishment, whatever the standard is for this kind of thing (if there is one) should be applied. I think that at this point he should be released with all journalistic privileges revoked.They're actually subjecting him to torture and aiming to jail him for 15 years. Do you seriously expect him to survive until he's released? I don't.

Galbally · Post by **Galbally** » Fri Dec 19, 2008 5:56 am

spot;1089486 wrote: They're actually subjecting him to torture and aiming to jail him for 15 years. Do you seriously expect him to survive until he's released? I don't.

Hold on, you don't know if they are subjecting him to anything, thats just media reports. Also, I sincerely doubt if he will get any sentence for throwing the shoes at Bush, its just the Iraqi government keeping up diplomatic nicities. He will be let go no later than Jan 21st 2009.

I thought the shoe throwing incident was a classic by the way, though he was a lousy shot, and Bush's quip after was quite good, as were his reflexes. Still, all in all, as summing up statements go about the Bush Presidency go, it was a pretty good one.

Post by **spot** » Fri Dec 19, 2008 6:29 am

Galbally;1089505 wrote: Hold on, you don't know if they are subjecting him to anything, thats just media reports.The judge conceded he was in a battered state but claimed his arm wasn't broken. His brother was the source of the torture allegation as well as the suggestion, based on having known him for a lifetime, that the statement could only have been made under coercion. Keeping him isolated is what you'd expect if he were in a bad state and that's what's happened, nobody's allowed to see him. No legal team, no relatives, nobody. Just the judge.

Post by **spot** » Fri Dec 19, 2008 8:17 am

People across the US are mailing a used trainer to the White House as parting insult. I hope it catches on in a big way.

Holding him in isolation instead of allowing, say, the Red Cross to visit him, is dreadful PR if he really sent that begging letter to President Maliki.

Does anyone remember Comical Ali? People thought he was a lunatic but he was pretty accurate at predicting what would happen once the fighting stopped. I wonder where he is now?

Post by **spot** » Sun Dec 21, 2008 9:02 am

I note that Muntadar Al Zaidi is still being held captive. He still hasn't even been allowed a visit from either his family or from any lawyer. Just a judge. He should be freed immediately. If the Iraqi authorities really want to prosecute him then fine, prosecute him, but there's no reason at all for holding him incommunicado or even on remand before the trial.

A sympathy resolution was passed in Pakistan:A Pakistani provincial assembly has passed a unique resolution praising the act of an Iraqi journalist who threw his shoes at US President George W. Bush last Sunday. The resolution says: "The shoe tossing by the Iraqi journalist on President Bush is a reflection of hatred and anger Iraqi people feel towards the US policies in Iraq. The journalist Muntadar Al Zaidi has acted in accordance with the public sentiments and such incidents do happen in democratic cultures," it added.

The resolution was adopted unanimously and backed by all parties in Pakistan's North West Frontier Province (NWFP) assembly, including the ruling Pakistan Peoples Party (PPP).

Gulfnews: Assembly resolution praises show-throwing journalist

gmc · Post by **gmc** » Sun Dec 21, 2008 10:10 am

we live in a country where people have a right to protest. When GW had his state visit here in 2003 they had thousands of police protecting him-they even had armed guards from the states this in a country where we do not allow the police to carry arms except in exceptional circumstances. They kept the streets clear of demonstrators

BBC NEWS | UK | Politics | Blair defends George Bush visit

All so GW could be sheltered from the fact that he was visiting a country where the right to protest is taken for granted and possibly he would have faced more than shoes being thrown at him and the likelihood of panicking American security guards opening fire on british protesters must have given Tony the heebie jeebies. there is something wrong when the leaders of democratic countries need to be protected from protesters against their policies, even more so when they think they have a right to stifle protest. Maybe exposure to british protesters baying for blood would have been too much for someone not used to the idea that people are allowed to protest.

A british journalist doing a similar thing in the UK would probably just received a slap on the wrist anything more draconian would raise a tremendous outcry. Nor would we tolerate the police beating him up once he was arrested. It's part and parcel of being in politics for a politician that people can hackle and sometimes throw things. It's a fairly safe bet that shoes will replace more traditional missiles in future as missiles of choice.

If you live in a free country then it shouldn't be too hard to accept that others may feel they have a right to protest in their own country about something they find detestable. Maybe if we all started throwing things at politicians more often they might be better politicians. Although such traditions have probably gone forever now in the present security conscious climate.

Fears for shoe-throwing journalist as he fails to appear in court - Telegraph

posted by jester

I would note that had the man done this under Saddam, he'd be tortured to death, his sons would be killed, his married daughters expelled from the country and his unmarried daughters acutioned off to wealthy families in the kingdom.

I would note freedom and democracy are supposedly in place in Iraq. That means he should be charged and brought to trial in a court of law. A jury of his peers would probably acquit him thus proving that freedom has returned to iraq. Seems though that iraq is still a police state.

Post by **Oscar Namechange** » Sun Dec 21, 2008 10:19 am

I myself do not believe that the journalist should get away with it. A world leader was assaulted who-ever he was. Gmc is correct about the lengths our government had to go to to protect Bush when he was here. Quite rightly said, if a member of the British public had of thrown some-thing at him, they would not have been beaten up by police.

I don't believe there is any more democracy and freedom in Iraq than there was before we invaded.

Does any-one in britain remember that lovely story about Bush's visit here with the schoolboys??

Bush was walking to a pub with Tony Blair in the full glare of the media and people were lined up the street. Bush went over to some young schoolboys and said 'Hi, I'm the President of the United States'. One schoolboy replied 'So what?'

Priceless :yh_rotfl

gmc · Post by **gmc** » Sun Dec 21, 2008 3:34 pm

Real freedom is maintained by having a healthy disrespect for politicians and those who claim entitlement to respect because of their position regardless of what they do while in that position.

Chookie · Post by **Chookie** » Sun Dec 21, 2008 3:40 pm

gmc;1091154 wrote: Real freedom is maintained by having a healthy disrespect for politicians and those who claim entitlement to respect because of their position regardless of what they do while in that position.

I agree 100%. No politician (or anyone else) deserves respect purely because of the position they hold. In fact, as they hold what is commonly termed "high office", they should be held to more stringent account.

Post by **Bryn Mawr** » Sun Dec 21, 2008 3:40 pm

mikeinie;1089481 wrote: Never mind the fact for the moment that it was Bush, a world leader was addressing the press with their own country’s leader.

The press was invited as guests; this guy abused his position as a journalist with access to world leaders to voice his discontent. This is not a public place or open forum. It was rude and inexcusable.

As far a punishment, whatever the standard is for this kind of thing (if there is one) should be applied. I think that at this point he should be released with all journalistic privileges revoked.

It was the latest in a long and honourable line of political protests. It does not justify the violence of the response or the proposed sentence.

Galbally · Post by **Galbally** » Sun Dec 21, 2008 5:38 pm

Jester;1091197 wrote: Attempted assault is not an acceptable form of protest. Had I been there I'd have shot him through on the spot before he got off his second shoe. It would have been my reaction. Had he stuck his hand up and stated a protest that would have been acceptable to me and I would have kept my sidearm holstered.

Your getting soft in your old age Jester. :wah:

Post by **Oscar Namechange** » Mon Dec 22, 2008 11:42 am

Jester;1091275 wrote: True'nuff if I were twenty again he'd have never got his first shoe off.

I have to agree with you my little gun-slinger.

I don't agree with the violence he has been shown and i agree with Mikie in that it would have been more appropriate to revoke his journalism licence. I have to be honest and say, if i was at a press conference and i saw some-one throw anything at my Prime Minister, I'd have jumped on him. Then i'd have been dragged away by British Police, beaten up in a cell or shot in the head claiming i was a terrorist, libeled and fitted up for 'Holocaust denial'.

I forgot, British Police don't do any of that do they?