Dogs as slaves

Discussions about your pets!
Post Reply
Ahso!
Posts: 10215
Joined: Wed Nov 11, 2009 1:38 pm

Dogs as slaves

Post by Ahso! »

You're a smart man, Spot.

I've been observing my relationship with my dogs and I've got to agree its one of slave and master. Funny, I've never recognized it before. Its only since I've been trying to understand how they see me that that has become evident. I'd like to believe its companionship for all and that I'm just a good person giving a needy animal a decent place to live, but I guess I've fooled myself again.

Well, I'm already in this and I need to make the best of it. Thanks for the heads up.
“Those who can make you believe absurdities can make you commit atrocities,”

Voltaire



I have only one thing to do and that's

Be the wave that I am and then

Sink back into the ocean

Fiona Apple
User avatar
flopstock
Posts: 7406
Joined: Sat Dec 29, 2007 2:52 am

Dogs as slaves

Post by flopstock »

I got up at 6 am today to take my dog for her walk before it got hot out today. She sits home all day eating, drinking, sleeping and playing with her pack-mate(my daughter). She was trained(like her pack-mate was trained) to go to the bathroom in certain places. Unlike her pack-mate, she doesn't have to clean up after anyone that decides to get into the garbage or eat a leftover wrapper from supper for fun. No one cleans my toilet and yet hers is scooped at least weekly. I make my meals and hers. I brush my hair and hers. I have one pool in my back yard - it's a wading pool for her(not me or her pack-mate). If I'm going out to garden she likes to hang with me and just lays in the pool of fresh cold water watching me sweat...

My dog is no more a slave than she would be to any alpha bitch she lived with.
I expressly forbid the use of any of my posts anywhere outside of FG (with the exception of the incredibly witty 'get a room already' )posted recently.

Folks who'd like to copy my intellectual work should expect to pay me for it.:-6

User avatar
Odie
Posts: 33482
Joined: Mon Jul 21, 2008 9:10 pm

Dogs as slaves

Post by Odie »

Ahso!;1322105 wrote: You're a smart man, Spot.

I've been observing my relationship with my dogs and I've got to agree its one of slave and master. Funny, I've never recognized it before. Its only since I've been trying to understand how they see me that that has become evident. I'd like to believe its companionship for all and that I'm just a good person giving a needy animal a decent place to live, but I guess I've fooled myself again.

Well, I'm already in this and I need to make the best of it. Thanks for the heads up.


having more than one there is always a pack leader, which is the dog who leads them, stays with them, they do what she/he does.

You are in command.

You should start watching 'The Dog Whisperer' or go to the site, and Cesar Milan can help you.
Life is just to short for drama.
User avatar
Peg
Posts: 8673
Joined: Tue Aug 24, 2004 12:00 pm

Dogs as slaves

Post by Peg »

My dog wants out, she goes to the door, I let her out. She wants food, she goes to her bowl, I feed her. If she is out of water, she barks at the sink, I get up and get her water. She has me well trained.
Ahso!
Posts: 10215
Joined: Wed Nov 11, 2009 1:38 pm

Dogs as slaves

Post by Ahso! »

But isn't it true that just about any freedom the dog enjoys is at your behest. In any slave/master relationship the master provides for the needs of the slave. We don't have to provide food and water to the dog if we choose not to. Then what?
“Those who can make you believe absurdities can make you commit atrocities,”

Voltaire



I have only one thing to do and that's

Be the wave that I am and then

Sink back into the ocean

Fiona Apple
User avatar
CARLA
Posts: 13033
Joined: Thu Nov 25, 2004 1:00 pm

Dogs as slaves

Post by CARLA »

In this context yes we are the master. Unless your like my 2 dogs were if they didn't get what they wanted at home they would just go next door and get it there, or the next house they had several master in the neighborhood. :)

But isn't it true that just about any freedom the dog enjoys is at your behest. In any slave/master relationship the master provides for the needs of the slave. We don't have to provide food and water to the dog if we choose not to. Then what?
ALOHA!!

MOTTO TO LIVE BY:

"Life should NOT be a journey to the grave with the intention of arriving safely in an attractive and well preserved body, but rather to skid in sideways, chocolate in one hand, champagne in the other, body thoroughly used up, totally worn out and screaming.

WOO HOO!!, what a ride!!!"

User avatar
YZGI
Posts: 11527
Joined: Thu Apr 06, 2006 11:24 am

Dogs as slaves

Post by YZGI »

Slaves were used to help make money. Dogs just cost money.
Ahso!
Posts: 10215
Joined: Wed Nov 11, 2009 1:38 pm

Dogs as slaves

Post by Ahso! »

Do you think dogs see a member of a different species as a pack member? I see my dogs vying for pack leader, but when I enter the room they act as if to worship me. They lick my feet, sit before me as if to be at attention and when i stand up or do something like move a chair for them to get their ball from under it the awe in their eyes is obvious. They must see us as a super species of sorts.
“Those who can make you believe absurdities can make you commit atrocities,”

Voltaire



I have only one thing to do and that's

Be the wave that I am and then

Sink back into the ocean

Fiona Apple
User avatar
Snowfire
Posts: 4835
Joined: Wed Mar 11, 2009 9:34 am

Dogs as slaves

Post by Snowfire »

The relationship is never even. Your dog has to accept you as number one with him/her subservient to you, otherwise your life would be a misery. As long as you both get out precisely what you want/need/expect (ie love, companionship, walks, food etc) then both parties are happy surely. A dog and/or owner who dont know their positions with each other just creates problems. Slave/ Master is maybe a simplistic way of describing it. It doesnt really allow for the relationship between dog and Man
"He has all the virtues I dislike and none of the vices I admire."

Winston Churchill
Ahso!
Posts: 10215
Joined: Wed Nov 11, 2009 1:38 pm

Dogs as slaves

Post by Ahso! »

YZGI;1322145 wrote: Slaves were used to help make money. Dogs just cost money.Some people have slaves for sex. Perhaps what dogs provide for us is a feeling of importance and superiority?
“Those who can make you believe absurdities can make you commit atrocities,”

Voltaire



I have only one thing to do and that's

Be the wave that I am and then

Sink back into the ocean

Fiona Apple
Ahso!
Posts: 10215
Joined: Wed Nov 11, 2009 1:38 pm

Dogs as slaves

Post by Ahso! »

Snowfire;1322148 wrote: The relationship is never even. Your dog has to accept you as number one with him/her subservient to you, otherwise your life would be a misery. As long as you both get out precisely what you want/need/expect (ie love, companionship, walks, food etc) then both parties are happy surely. A dog and/or owner who dont know their positions with each other just creates problems. Slave/ Master is maybe a simplistic way of describing it. It doesnt really allow for the relationship between dog and ManRemember what King Kong looked like to you the first time you saw that as a child? The awe you experienced? We loose that perspective as we grow and our intellect develops, but I doubt a dog or cat or most other species have the capacity to change that perspective because their brain stops developing. They may see us permanently as we first experienced King Kong or Godzilla.
“Those who can make you believe absurdities can make you commit atrocities,”

Voltaire



I have only one thing to do and that's

Be the wave that I am and then

Sink back into the ocean

Fiona Apple
User avatar
flopstock
Posts: 7406
Joined: Sat Dec 29, 2007 2:52 am

Dogs as slaves

Post by flopstock »

Ahso!;1322149 wrote: Some people have slaves for sex. Perhaps what dogs provide for us is a feeling of importance and superiority?
If that's what your dog is for you, I urge you to give your dog up to a rescue organization.



Folks like to use terms to stir the beast and conversations, I understand that. But my dog? I've canceled vacation for that dog. I've gotten her shots when I couldn't afford it, in the past. My dog is a member of the family. My dog makes us play keep away with that ball in her mouth as often as she drops it for me to throw for her.

You may feel the need to apologize for your relationship with your pup. I don't.... and I think it's sad that you do simply because of someone else's viewpoint.
I expressly forbid the use of any of my posts anywhere outside of FG (with the exception of the incredibly witty 'get a room already' )posted recently.

Folks who'd like to copy my intellectual work should expect to pay me for it.:-6

User avatar
spot
Posts: 41336
Joined: Tue Apr 19, 2005 5:19 pm
Location: Brigstowe

Dogs as slaves

Post by spot »

Thank goodness I never mentioned the Emergency Rations In Hard Times option.

The relationship between the domesticated dog and humans was part of a general discussion of intrinsic mammalian behaviors, and pointed out that man has the capacity to be awed by what he interprets as God. I wondered whether the mechanism of both canine-to-human and human-to-God responses relies on the same mental state. It was, as you can imagine, a speculative approach but it's probably testable.
Nullius in verba ... ☎||||||||||| ... To Fate I sue, of other means bereft, the only refuge for the wretched left.
When flower power came along I stood for Human Rights, marched around for peace and freedom, had some nooky every night - we took it serious.
Who has a spare two minutes to play in this month's FG Trivia game! ... My other OS is Slackware.
User avatar
Bryn Mawr
Posts: 16113
Joined: Mon Feb 27, 2006 4:54 pm

Dogs as slaves

Post by Bryn Mawr »

Ahso!;1322147 wrote: Do you think dogs see a member of a different species as a pack member? I see my dogs vying for pack leader, but when I enter the room they act as if to worship me. They lick my feet, sit before me as if to be at attention and when i stand up or do something like move a chair for them to get their ball from under it the awe in their eyes is obvious. They must see us as a super species of sorts.


Very much as a pack leader - I've seen families where the owners tried to treat the dogs as "one of the children" and never managed to get the pack leader role. Total chaos.
User avatar
flopstock
Posts: 7406
Joined: Sat Dec 29, 2007 2:52 am

Dogs as slaves

Post by flopstock »

spot;1322163 wrote: Thank goodness I never mentioned the Emergency Rations In Hard Times option.

The relationship between the domesticated dog and humans was part of a general discussion of intrinsic mammalian behaviors, and pointed out that man has the capacity to be awed by what he interprets as God. I wondered whether the mechanism of both canine-to-human and human-to-God responses relies on the same mental state. It was, as you can imagine, a speculative approach but it's probably testable.


Sorry dear, not ignoring your contribution but also not pulling the thesaurus or dictionary for this discussion. So i'll just say hi!
I expressly forbid the use of any of my posts anywhere outside of FG (with the exception of the incredibly witty 'get a room already' )posted recently.

Folks who'd like to copy my intellectual work should expect to pay me for it.:-6

User avatar
spot
Posts: 41336
Joined: Tue Apr 19, 2005 5:19 pm
Location: Brigstowe

Dogs as slaves

Post by spot »

It would take a lot more words to say the same thing in Basic English.
Nullius in verba ... ☎||||||||||| ... To Fate I sue, of other means bereft, the only refuge for the wretched left.
When flower power came along I stood for Human Rights, marched around for peace and freedom, had some nooky every night - we took it serious.
Who has a spare two minutes to play in this month's FG Trivia game! ... My other OS is Slackware.
Ahso!
Posts: 10215
Joined: Wed Nov 11, 2009 1:38 pm

Dogs as slaves

Post by Ahso! »

spot;1322163 wrote: Thank goodness I never mentioned the Emergency Rations In Hard Times option.

The relationship between the domesticated dog and humans was part of a general discussion of intrinsic mammalian behaviors, and pointed out that man has the capacity to be awed by what he interprets as God. I wondered whether the mechanism of both canine-to-human and human-to-God responses relies on the same mental state. It was, as you can imagine, a speculative approach but it's probably testable.I believe I recall you making very similar statements on FG a couple of times not in this context, but in threads about general pet ownership. Are you going to make me search for them?
“Those who can make you believe absurdities can make you commit atrocities,”

Voltaire



I have only one thing to do and that's

Be the wave that I am and then

Sink back into the ocean

Fiona Apple
Ahso!
Posts: 10215
Joined: Wed Nov 11, 2009 1:38 pm

Dogs as slaves

Post by Ahso! »

flopstock;1322159 wrote: If that's what your dog is for you, I urge you to give your dog up to a rescue organization.



Folks like to use terms to stir the beast and conversations, I understand that. But my dog? I've canceled vacation for that dog. I've gotten her shots when I couldn't afford it, in the past. My dog is a member of the family. My dog makes us play keep away with that ball in her mouth as often as she drops it for me to throw for her.

You may feel the need to apologize for your relationship with your pup. I don't.... and I think it's sad that you do simply because of someone else's viewpoint.My intentions were not to apologize for my relationship with the family members classified as pets but instead to crystallize it. I now have a deeper appreciation and respect for them as a species.

We've also gone the extra distance for our pets. But when you consider the fact that a dog never really gets beyond that of a 4 year old child, and yet think of them, as many of us do, as protectors and companions when we tower over them in every conceivable way theres got to be something more to the issue.
“Those who can make you believe absurdities can make you commit atrocities,”

Voltaire



I have only one thing to do and that's

Be the wave that I am and then

Sink back into the ocean

Fiona Apple
User avatar
G#Gill
Posts: 14763
Joined: Thu Apr 05, 2007 1:09 pm

Dogs as slaves

Post by G#Gill »

Ahso, it really depends on the size of the dog, if you need one to protect you. Also the dog must accept you as pack leader, and any other members of your family must be ahead of the dog in pecking order. I believe this can be done by always feeding the dog after the humans have fed. I have found that a dog accepts the person that feeds it as pack leader, particularly if that person is male. In my case, however, the alpha female (me) mostly fed our dog. My hubby mostly walked him, along with my son. The order in our particular pack was, hubby (alpha male), son (second), and then myself (alpha female), and the dog accepted without question that he came fourth at all times. Our dog was a German Shepherd, which we adopted from the dog shelter aged 8 years, so it was essential that we started as we meant to go on, and our dog was never confused by mixed messages - he soon learnt, who was 'boss', and it was always done with kindness. He was never smacked, and was always rewarded with a small treat for doing as we asked him. At the age of 8 he was very willing to learn, and he learnt a lot very quickly. Consequently he was a joy to have around, and a delight to take out. He knew he was much loved and returned our love one hundred fold. They say you can't teach an old dog new tricks. I say that is absolute rubbish!

At no time was he a slave - he was another family member.
I'm a Saga-lout, growing old disgracefully
User avatar
Kathy Ellen
Posts: 10569
Joined: Wed Mar 15, 2006 4:04 pm

Dogs as slaves

Post by Kathy Ellen »

G#Gill;1322187 wrote: Ahso, it really depends on the size of the dog, if you need one to protect you. Also the dog must accept you as pack leader, and any other members of your family must be ahead of the dog in pecking order. I believe this can be done by always feeding the dog after the humans have fed. I have found that a dog accepts the person that feeds it as pack leader, particularly if that person is male. In my case, however, the alpha female (me) mostly fed our dog. My hubby mostly walked him, along with my son. The order in our particular pack was, hubby (alpha male), son (second), and then myself (alpha female), and the dog accepted without question that he came fourth at all times. Our dog was a German Shepherd, which we adopted from the dog shelter aged 8 years, so it was essential that we started as we meant to go on, and our dog was never confused by mixed messages - he soon learnt, who was 'boss', and it was always done with kindness. He was never smacked, and was always rewarded with a small treat for doing as we asked him. At the age of 8 he was very willing to learn, and he learnt a lot very quickly. Consequently he was a joy to have around, and a delight to take out. He knew he was much loved and returned our love one hundred fold. They say you can't teach an old dog new tricks. I say that is absolute rubbish!

At no time was he a slave - he was another family member.


That's beautiful Gill. Good for Rex and your family to have had such wonderful years together:-4
Ahso!
Posts: 10215
Joined: Wed Nov 11, 2009 1:38 pm

Dogs as slaves

Post by Ahso! »

I don't know, Spot, I just watched a Nova presentation on the relationship between humans and dogs and the show makes a pretty compelling case that the two go back possibly as far as 100,000 years ago and assisted one another in survival and consequentially grew close as companions. And you know me, I'm an evolutionist. Heres a link in case anyone is interested in viewing the program, its quite interesting.

NOVA | Dogs Decoded
“Those who can make you believe absurdities can make you commit atrocities,”

Voltaire



I have only one thing to do and that's

Be the wave that I am and then

Sink back into the ocean

Fiona Apple
friendly_firefly
Posts: 1
Joined: Thu May 16, 2013 8:03 pm

Dogs as slaves

Post by friendly_firefly »

When there is another living entity (e.g. slaves, dogs ... whatever) who are not allowed freedom to do their stuff but exists only for the 'owner' then that entity is slace. Over history, there were slave owners who were kind and other not so much. So are their dog owners ... who are kind and other not so much. At the end of the day, if a dog strays out ... it would be caught by the system and either returned to the owner, put to a jail or killed (as was with the slave). The dogs kids are sold where the owner of the dog gets the money. Same with the slaves. The dogs gets to mate only when they are allowed and with whom they are allowed ... like slaves. Yes they guide blind people, help police and so on. But, they are just working for people in way people want them to.

Today's dogs are there to cater to enslavement mentality of humans. Dogs have taken the place of slaves.
gmc
Posts: 13566
Joined: Sun Aug 29, 2004 9:44 am

Dogs as slaves

Post by gmc »

Dogs are dogs anthropomorphising them doesn't change that. They're useful to us otherwise they would have been exterminated like the wolves have where they got in the way. That they relate to us as members of a pack is I think true, sort of the dog that walked.

I have two if you were about to ask.
Post Reply

Return to “The Pets In Our Lives”