What a disgrace

Post by **Oscar Namechange** » Thu Feb 21, 2013 10:31 am

George Galloway storms out of Oxford University: 'I don't recognise Israel and I don't debate with Israelis' | Mail Online

Now his true colours are being shown at last.

Now we're seeing what Nationalist Parties have known for years.

AnneBoleyn · Post by **AnneBoleyn** » Thu Feb 21, 2013 1:11 pm

Let him storm out. He's a moron.

theia · Post by **theia** » Thu Feb 21, 2013 1:14 pm

AnneBoleyn;1420863 wrote: Let him storm out. He's a moron.

I would probably agree with that.

Post by **Oscar Namechange** » Thu Feb 21, 2013 1:27 pm

Here's the Irony....

George Galloway Is a supporter and funds the UAF ( Unite Against Fascism ). Their main objective Is to drive out the Far Right organisations and Parties of Great Britain because they are deemed errrr racist.

Racism Is not exclusive. The BNP can not be racist In the eye's of GG while he touts for votes In the Muslim communities of the North ( the only hope In hell he had of getting returned Into parliament ) and then rail against Israel. That Is racism... to discriminate against another human being because of his colour, religion or origin.

Still... at least the entire country can now see what a revolting hypocrite he Is and can see what we knew for years.... bet he didn't know he was being filmed.

AnneBoleyn · Post by **AnneBoleyn** » Thu Feb 21, 2013 1:29 pm

Today we all must assume we are being filmed. We walk down our own streets and are filmed.

gmc · Post by **gmc** » Thu Feb 21, 2013 1:39 pm

He does rather have a point does he not? Israel refuses to recognise the Palestinian state so why should he not reciprocate. You can't really debate with someone about Palestine when they refuse to accept the state has a right to exist. To suggest he walked out because the speaker was Jewish is a bit disingenuous to put it mildly.

Pity though, would have been an interesting debate.

AnneBoleyn · Post by **AnneBoleyn** » Thu Feb 21, 2013 1:42 pm

He has no point. He is not Palestinian. He has no dog in the fight except the one he created. People should talk to each other, an open conversation is open to all. Can hardly wait for the Aussies to leave & give it back to aborigines. Same for USA & native Americans. Same for the thousands of societies that replaced others.

Never Again.

Bruv · Post by **Bruv** » Thu Feb 21, 2013 4:02 pm

Everything the man says is worth listening to.

You have to forget his demeanour, his phraseology, and his arrogance and listen to exactly what he says.

He has yet again made people think, provoked a reaction over an event that would have gone unnoticed.

If he honestly believes Israel does not or more likely should not exist, then Israelis can't exist.

AnneBoleyn · Post by **AnneBoleyn** » Thu Feb 21, 2013 4:31 pm

Bruv;1420928 wrote: Everything the man says is worth listening to.

You have to forget his demeanour, his phraseology, and his arrogance and listen to exactly what he says.

He has yet again made people think, provoked a reaction over an event that would have gone unnoticed.

If he honestly believes Israel does not or more likely should not exist, then Israelis can't exist.

The last sentence is where you lost me. I agree with the rest.

Post by **Oscar Namechange** » Thu Feb 21, 2013 4:34 pm

He's a walking contradiction .

If he does not recognise Israel then how can he ask the student ' Are you an Israeli ' ?

He supports Palestine... so do many people. What he claims Is that one exists and the other does not.

Video: George Galloway storms out of debate after asking student: 'are you an Israeli?' - Telegraph

Bruv · Post by **Bruv** » Thu Feb 21, 2013 4:40 pm

He believes Israel doesn't or shouldn't exist.

So if Israel doesn't exist, there are no Israelis.

I think what he said was "I don't recognise Israel"

There are many countries that hold the same view, him flouncing out like a big girly......................might make people question their own position.

It is always healthy to try and see a problem from your opponents point of view.

Post by **Oscar Namechange** » Thu Feb 21, 2013 4:45 pm

Bruv;1420936 wrote:

So if Israel doesn't exist, there are no Israelis.

. So how can he ask ' Are you Israeli '?

Bruv · Post by **Bruv** » Thu Feb 21, 2013 4:46 pm

oscar;1420935 wrote: He's a walking contradiction .

If he does not recognise Israel then how can he ask the student ' Are you an Israeli ' ?

He supports Palestine... so do many people. What he claims Is that one exists and the other does not.

Video: George Galloway storms out of debate after asking student: 'are you an Israeli?' - Telegraph

He knows that Israel dominates the politics of the region, he does not recognise the legitimacy of their claim.

And how could he have posed the question concerning the mans origin ?

Post by **Oscar Namechange** » Thu Feb 21, 2013 4:47 pm

Bruv;1420938 wrote: He knows that Israel dominates the politics of the region, he does not recognise the legitimacy of their claim.

And how could he have posed the question concerning the mans origin ? He could have remained and politely debated with the student.

Bruv · Post by **Bruv** » Thu Feb 21, 2013 4:49 pm

oscar;1420939 wrote: He could have remained and politely debated with the student.

And nobody would be talking about it now, like all those irritating adverts...............he has done what he wanted to do, made lots of people talk about the topic.

AnneBoleyn · Post by **AnneBoleyn** » Thu Feb 21, 2013 5:14 pm

oscar;1420937 wrote: So how can he ask ' Are you Israeli '?

Wish I said that!

theia · Post by **theia** » Fri Feb 22, 2013 12:22 am

Bruv;1420940 wrote: And nobody would be talking about it now, like all those irritating adverts...............he has done what he wanted to do, made lots of people talk about the topic.

Do you think that was his intention, Bruv? I think that all (okay, most) politicians are wanting to promote their own reputation and ego in whichever way they can however vehemently they might deny this.

Bruv · Post by **Bruv** » Fri Feb 22, 2013 4:53 am

theia;1420963 wrote: Do you think that was his intention, Bruv? I think that all (okay, most) politicians are wanting to promote their own reputation and ego in whichever way they can however vehemently they might deny this.
I don't know what his intentions were, but I know the result of his actions.

I find the man cringe worthy, but I always try to put my personal impressions aside and listen to the message rather than dissect the man's short comings ,and my own of course.

He does appear to be grandstanding most of the time, but listening to his words rather than the delivery, I tend to agree with much of what he says.

Saint_ · Post by **Saint_** » Fri Feb 22, 2013 10:18 am

gmc;1420877 wrote: Israel refuses to recognise the Palestinian state so why should he not reciprocate. .

Well, Israel was officially recognized by the US and Russia right after the United Nations Partition plan. That plan was necessary because of the tensions in the area and, I suspect, because of the world's tendency to look out after the Jewish people immediately following the Holocaust.

The "Palestinians," on the other hand, are composed of leftovers from the Persian invasion, the Roman invasion, and the Ottoman Empire. They have never really been a cohesive "people" per se. Just about anyone living in that area at one time or another, regardless of culture or race could be considered "Palestinian" including the Jewish people themselves.

That fragmented, wandering, and disjointed history makes it difficult for me to understand their "claim" to the entire region or their hatred of the Israelis.

I certainly understand the reason why the Israelis refuse to recognize them, though. They have shown nothing but terroristic tendencies, have continued open and guerrilla warfare constantly, and basically show virtually no stability or responsibility necessary for a people to be a country and not a mob.

Scrat · Post by **Scrat** » Fri Feb 22, 2013 10:37 am

As he stated, he was misled. That in itself was enough reason to walk out, let alone what he had probably been baited into.

Israel is an example of everything that is wrong with this world. I do not respect the country, I do not respect Zionists. They're terrorists themselves. I can definitely respect Galloway, he's got the cajones to take a stand.

Scrat · Post by **Scrat** » Fri Feb 22, 2013 10:42 am

I certainly understand the reason why the Israelis refuse to recognize them, though. They have shown nothing but terroristic tendencies, have continued open and guerrilla warfare constantly, and basically show virtually no stability or responsibility necessary for a people to be a country and not a mob.

Dig a little into the history, don't use western sources to do it either. Educate yourself.

Saint_ · Post by **Saint_** » Fri Feb 22, 2013 10:46 am

Scrat;1421006 wrote: Dig a little into the history, don't use western sources to do it either. Educate yourself.

Well, I just spent a half hour reading the entire history of Israel from prehistory to modern day...that's a good try at being educated. I know you are Anti-Israel and Pro-Palestinian, but since I've never heard of an Israeli suicide bombing a children's toy store and I have heard of a Palestinian doing that...

I'm coming down on the Israeli's side.

Post by **Oscar Namechange** » Fri Feb 22, 2013 11:25 am

My Issue with GG Is this...

Supporting Palestine would be far more beneficial to a politician If he recognized the State that he claims Is persecuting them. You can not have one without the other That's Impossible.

Bruv · Post by **Bruv** » Fri Feb 22, 2013 11:51 am

Saint_;1421007 wrote: Well, I just spent a half hour reading the entire history of Israel from prehistory to modern day...that's a good try at being educated. I know you are Anti-Israel and Pro-Palestinian, but since I've never heard of an Israeli suicide bombing a children's toy store and I have heard of a Palestinian doing that...

I'm coming down on the Israeli's side.

Are you being ironic ?

Is this post for real ?

I say that because I have just read the whole of American History from prehistory until today (It took me a good twenty minutes) and I have come down on the native American side.

Post by **Bryn Mawr** » Fri Feb 22, 2013 3:13 pm

AnneBoleyn;1420863 wrote: Let him storm out. He's a moron.

Ran rings around your House Committee though

Saint_ · Post by **Saint_** » Fri Feb 22, 2013 3:20 pm

Bruv;1421037 wrote: Are you being ironic ?

Is this post for real ?

I say that because I have just read the whole of American History from prehistory until today (It took me a good twenty minutes) and I have come down on the native American side.

hahahah! Touche! OK, OK, ...it WAS the Wikipedia condensed version... but still, I really have a problem supporting the cause of any group that specifically targets children and young people for suicide bombings.

Post by **Bryn Mawr** » Fri Feb 22, 2013 3:35 pm

Saint_;1420999 wrote: Well, Israel was officially recognized by the US and Russia right after the United Nations Partition plan. That plan was necessary because of the tensions in the area and, I suspect, because of the world's tendency to look out after the Jewish people immediately following the Holocaust.

The "Palestinians," on the other hand, are composed of leftovers from the Persian invasion, the Roman invasion, and the Ottoman Empire. They have never really been a cohesive "people" per se. Just about anyone living in that area at one time or another, regardless of culture or race could be considered "Palestinian" including the Jewish people themselves.

That fragmented, wandering, and disjointed history makes it difficult for me to understand their "claim" to the entire region or their hatred of the Israelis.

I certainly understand the reason why the Israelis refuse to recognize them, though. They have shown nothing but terroristic tendencies, have continued open and guerrilla warfare constantly, and basically show virtually no stability or responsibility necessary for a people to be a country and not a mob.

Sorry but wherever they came from and whatever you want to call them the region was populated before the influx of the Jewish people who declared the state of Israel before the end of the Mandate.

Since that declaration there has been a systematic effort to drive the original population out of the territory - the original terroristic tendancies and open and guerrilla warfare was carried out by the Stern Gang and Irgun against the Palestinians, not the other way about, and the bulk of the killing and destruction is still going in that direction.

If youi have difficulty understanding their claim to the entire region could you please explain to me Israel's clain to owning the entire region? Why, given the number of Palestinians killed by Israeli troops and imprissoned without trial, do you find it so difficult to understand the hatred that causes.

Bruv · Post by **Bruv** » Fri Feb 22, 2013 3:36 pm

Saint_;1421061 wrote: hahahah! Touche! OK, OK, ...it WAS the Wikipedia condensed version... but still, I really have a problem supporting the cause of any group that specifically targets children and young people for suicide bombings.
They don't show all the Palestinian children pulled from the rubble of Israeli missile strikes on US TV ?

Is Israel still the biggest recipient of US aid ?

Post by **Bryn Mawr** » Fri Feb 22, 2013 3:40 pm

Saint_;1421007 wrote: Well, I just spent a half hour reading the entire history of Israel from prehistory to modern day...that's a good try at being educated. I know you are Anti-Israel and Pro-Palestinian, but since I've never heard of an Israeli suicide bombing a children's toy store and I have heard of a Palestinian doing that...

I'm coming down on the Israeli's side.

After half and hour you are not even beginning to skim the surface.

Try searching for the Israeli army reservist who walked into a Mosque during Friday service and began machine gunning the congregation - it's well documented and predates all of the Palestinian suicide bombings. Until you know the history you cannot know tit from tat.

AnneBoleyn · Post by **AnneBoleyn** » Fri Feb 22, 2013 3:42 pm

If it weren't for Europeans & their 2,000 year Holocaust against the Jewish people there may not have been an Israel. Blame yourselves. The European White Man caused much, even Most, of the world's problems.

For 2,000 years whenever Jews would meet, & especially during Passover, the last words of the conversation were: Next Year in Jerusalem. For 2,000 years, not since WWII.

Israel has made many, too many, mistakes since the '67 war. The Arab population should have been dispersed into Jordan. Yes, dispersed.

The European White Man has caused this, throughout history, yet you refuse to accept your responsibility.

Never Again.

Post by **Oscar Namechange** » Fri Feb 22, 2013 3:43 pm

Bruv;1421064 wrote: They don't show all the Palestinian children pulled from the rubble of Israeli missile strikes on US TV ?

Is Israel still the biggest recipient of US aid ?

Yep

Given that U.S. military aid to Israel was $2.775 billion in 2010, $3 billion in 2011, $3.07 billion in 2012 (and $3.15 billion per year from 2013-2018) while Israel's defense budget is around $15 billion

Read more: Here's How Much America REALLY Spends On Israel's Defense - Business Insider

Post by **Bryn Mawr** » Fri Feb 22, 2013 3:44 pm

Saint_;1421061 wrote: hahahah! Touche! OK, OK, ...it WAS the Wikipedia condensed version... but still, I really have a problem supporting the cause of any group that specifically targets children and young people for suicide bombings.

How many children and young people did the Israeli army kill during the last invasion of Gaza? They were deliberately shelling schools FGS - learn your history and you might just begin to see what's going on.

AnneBoleyn · Post by **AnneBoleyn** » Fri Feb 22, 2013 3:49 pm

The thing is Europe has been fighting amongst themselves for thousands of years too. But now, these aging civilizations are tired of that. You've only been tired for 68 years & now the fight has been beaten out of you & you set yourselves up against Israel! What hypocrisy! Talking about what the Israeli army does to the Palestinians, setting yourselves up as moral judges. A little late, my friends, a little late.

eta--I too share many of the same objections as to Israel's overkill. However, if they rid themselves of the Arab population (no Arab country accepted the Palestinians willingly, not a one) then Israel would not be in this disgusting position that they put themselves in. It is horrible to live in these places, & I don't blame any palestinian child who grows up hating them. Makes perfect sense to me.

Bruv · Post by **Bruv** » Fri Feb 22, 2013 3:49 pm

AnneBoleyn;1421066 wrote: If it weren't for Europeans & their 2,000 year Holocaust against the Jewish people there may not have been an Israel. Blame yourselves. The European White Man caused much, even Most, of the world's problems.

For 2,000 years whenever Jews would meet, & especially during Passover, the last words of the conversation were: Next Year in Jerusalem. For 2,000 years, not since WWII.

Israel has made many, too many, mistakes since the '67 war. The Arab population should have been dispersed into Jordan. Yes, dispersed.

The European White Man has caused this, throughout history, yet you refuse to accept your responsibility.

Never Again.

I tad over simplified, I know what you mean though.

The homeland 'solution' hasn't stopped the problem, it has moved it sideways.

AnneBoleyn · Post by **AnneBoleyn** » Fri Feb 22, 2013 3:57 pm

Bruv;1421072 wrote: I tad over simplified, I know what you mean though.

The homeland 'solution' hasn't stopped the problem, it has moved it sideways.

Yes, it is simple. Don't look for complicated when it is simple. Most people think simply. They know who is killing them now. Who has been killing them. FOR THOUSANDS OF YEARS. Sorry to shout.

Maybe if you stopped fanning Palestinian flames & stopped the European hypocrisy, it would help.

Post by **Bryn Mawr** » Fri Feb 22, 2013 3:59 pm

AnneBoleyn;1421071 wrote: The thing is Europe has been fighting amongst themselves for thousands of years too. But now, these aging civilizations are tired of that. You've only been tired for 68 years & now the fight has been beaten out of you & you set yourselves up against Israel! What hypocrisy! Talking about what the Israeli army does to the Palestinians, setting yourselves up as moral judges. A little late, my friends, a little late.

eta--I too share many of the same objections as to Israel's overkill. However, if they rid themselves of the Arab population (no Arab country accepted the Palestinians willingly, not a one) then Israel would not be in this disgusting position that they put themselves in. It is horrible to live in these places, & I don't blame any palestinian child who grows up hating them. Makes perfect sense to me.

Why should they "rid themselves of the Arab population"? Not only were the Arabs there first but the Israeli constitution commits them to equal status.

Post by **Bryn Mawr** » Fri Feb 22, 2013 4:00 pm

AnneBoleyn;1421073 wrote: Yes, it is simple. Don't look for complicated when it is simple. Most people think simply. They know who is killing them now. Who has been killing them. FOR THOUSANDS OF YEARS. Sorry to shout.

Maybe if you stopped fanning Palestinian flames & stopped the European hypocrisy, it would help.

We non of us can change thousands of years of history but we can damn'd well change the injustice of today.

Post by **Oscar Namechange** » Fri Feb 22, 2013 4:06 pm

AnneBoleyn;1421073 wrote: Yes, it is simple. Don't look for complicated when it is simple. Most people think simply. They know who is killing them now. Who has been killing them. FOR THOUSANDS OF YEARS. Sorry to shout.

Maybe if you stopped fanning Palestinian flames & stopped the European hypocrisy, it would help. The problem Is the disproportionate use of military warfare against Palestinians who simply do not have the military hardware to pose any real threat to Israel. Ocassionally they get lucky and a missile will land In Southern Israel but collateral damage Is minimal. When Israel Ignores UN rulings and targets UN buildings, schools and hospitals along with the use of banned white Phosphorus on children, the only terrorists are the Israeli military.

AnneBoleyn · Post by **AnneBoleyn** » Fri Feb 22, 2013 4:08 pm

Bryn Mawr;1421074 wrote: Why should they "rid themselves of the Arab population"? Not only were the Arabs there first but the Israeli constitution commits them to equal status.

Sorry, I meant to say 'palestinian', or those unfortunate enough to live in those godforsaken refugee camps. I do feel for them, but they have been displaced, like so many others throughout history. They are no better, & Israel is no worse, than any other people throughout the world who have found themselves in this position.

Has any wealthy Arab nation truly offered to help relocate the Palestinians? Of course not. Did ANY muslim country help when the Yugoslave situation threatened the existence of the muslim Bosnian genocide at Srebrenica and Žepa committed by Bosnian Serb forces in 1995 or the ethnic cleansing campaign? Of course not, they never help anyone, just use people against Israel---that is the true reason.

AnneBoleyn · Post by **AnneBoleyn** » Fri Feb 22, 2013 4:10 pm

Bryn Mawr;1421075 wrote: We non of us can change thousands of years of history but we can damn'd well change the injustice of today.

And of course your morality starts with the Jewish People & the Situation YOU caused. Take responsibility or you are a Hypocrite. Don't like the way the shoe fits, do you?

AnneBoleyn · Post by **AnneBoleyn** » Fri Feb 22, 2013 4:13 pm

oscar;1421076 wrote: The problem Is the disproportionate use of military warfare against Palestinians who simply do not have the military hardware to pose any real threat to Israel. Ocassionally they get lucky and a missile will land In Southern Israel but collateral damage Is minimal. When Israel Ignores UN rulings and targets UN buildings, schools and hospitals along with the use of banned white Phosphorus on children, the only terrorists are the Israeli military.

I can't disagree here oscar my love, except in your use of the word 'terrorist'. It is overkill, & Israel is foolishly thinking enough force will stop the renegades amongst the palestinians. They are wrong, & that is why they should have dispersed the palestinians into Jordan. Enthically, the palestinians are Jordanian.

Bruv · Post by **Bruv** » Fri Feb 22, 2013 4:16 pm

AnneBoleyn;1421073 wrote: Yes, it is simple. Don't look for complicated when it is simple. Most people think simply. They know who is killing them now. Who has been killing them. FOR THOUSANDS OF YEARS. Sorry to shout.

Maybe if you stopped fanning Palestinian flames & stopped the European hypocrisy, it would help.

To make it as simple as possible, take a look at the growth from inception until today.

All that land had generations of families history invested in it, these families are now euphamistically 'displaced'

Palestinians are now reaping their own holocaust.

AnneBoleyn · Post by **AnneBoleyn** » Fri Feb 22, 2013 4:21 pm

Part of the problem is that no one gives up anymore. No one accepts. No one moves on. Of course for 2,000 years the Jews never accepted it either. Next Year in Jerusalem. For 2,000 years. But of course that yearning for a homeland for 2,000 years means little compared to 64 years. Right? Oh yeah, we've learned to be moral & gentle in that time. Except for Jews & that is why they don't budge an inch, & never should have to again. And they won't.

That is the situation caused by Europe. Live with it. Accept Responsibility for the Terror you have caused for millenia. Don't think you can all just hide & say you've learned your lesson about violence when that is patently not true. Oh right, except for Jews.

Post by **Oscar Namechange** » Fri Feb 22, 2013 4:21 pm

AnneBoleyn;1421079 wrote: I can't disagree here oscar my love, except in your use of the word 'terrorist'. It is overkill, & Israel is foolishly thinking enough force will stop the renegades amongst the palestinians. They are wrong, & that is why they should have dispersed the palestinians into Jordan. Enthically, the palestinians are Jordanian.

Any countries military who use banned white phosphorus on children are terrorists.

White Phosphorus burns on a Palestinian boy reported by The Guardian - YouTube

Free Palestine! Israel uses illegal White Phosphorus bombs - YouTube

AnneBoleyn · Post by **AnneBoleyn** » Fri Feb 22, 2013 4:23 pm

Bruv;1421080 wrote: To make it as simple as possible, take a look at the growth from inception until today.

All that land had generations of families history invested in it, these families are now euphamistically 'displaced'

Palestinians are now reaping their own holocaust.

Well, you reap what you sow. Move to Jordan. You sure have cajones to compare that to the Holocaust of 2,000 years, the endless pogroms in every country, culminating with the Master Race. Hypocrites, the lot of you, on this issue.

AnneBoleyn · Post by **AnneBoleyn** » Fri Feb 22, 2013 4:27 pm

oscar;1421084 wrote: Any countries military who use banned white phosphorus on children are terrorists.

White Phosphorus burns on a Palestinian boy reported by The Guardian - YouTube

Free Palestine! Israel uses illegal White Phosphorus bombs - YouTube

I have already said those acts are disgusting. If you wish to use the T word, fine. I don't agree, but I understand. In fact, I have the terrible ability to always see all sides to an issue. It would make my life easier if I didn't. I even understand why Saudis used planes as bombs to bring down my beloved Twin Towers. It was Israel. Always Israel.

Post by **Bryn Mawr** » Fri Feb 22, 2013 4:29 pm

AnneBoleyn;1421078 wrote: And of course your morality starts with the Jewish People & the Situation YOU caused. Take responsibility or you are a Hypocrite. Don't like the way the shoe fits, do you?

Care to explain that?

Where are you starting? The ending of the Mandate where the US and France opposed Britain's blocking of unrestricted immigration? Or the Balfour Declaration? Or the Zionist manefesto? Or ...

AnneBoleyn · Post by **AnneBoleyn** » Fri Feb 22, 2013 4:29 pm

I must take a break for now. I'm diabetic & I must insulin myself and eat.

AnneBoleyn · Post by **AnneBoleyn** » Fri Feb 22, 2013 4:31 pm

Bryn Mawr;1421087 wrote: Care to explain that?

Where are you starting? The ending of the Mandate where the US and France opposed Britain's blocking of unrestricted immigration? Or the Balfour Declaration? Or the Zionist manefesto? Or ...

Before my break----think simply then you will know. The Heart is a simple organ, not complicated.

Post by **Bryn Mawr** » Fri Feb 22, 2013 4:31 pm

AnneBoleyn;1421077 wrote: Sorry, I meant to say 'palestinian', or those unfortunate enough to live in those godforsaken refugee camps. I do feel for them, but they have been displaced, like so many others throughout history. They are no better, & Israel is no worse, than any other people throughout the world who have found themselves in this position.

Has any wealthy Arab nation truly offered to help relocate the Palestinians? Of course not. Did ANY muslim country help when the Yugoslave situation threatened the existence of the muslim Bosnian genocide at Srebrenica and ï¿½epa committed by Bosnian Serb forces in 1995 or the ethnic cleansing campaign? Of course not, they never help anyone, just use people against Israel---that is the true reason.

How does this justify the Israeli treatment of their Palestinian citizens?