I have signed the following petition from 38 Degrees:
https://you.38degrees.org.uk/petitions/ ... efit-cards
This is is response to a motion being put forward to do away with Benefit Payments & replace them with Pre-Payment Cards (essentially, Food Stamps), with which to purchase the predetermined items, with the intention that this will stop the claimant from wasting the benefits on such things as cigarettes or alcohol.
While I can see where they're coming from, it is just not practical. When someone wants money to buy things that are not on the prescribed list they will simply end up selling the card for less than its face value, thus increasing the problem further. It will also greatly increase admin costs as well as masses of Red Tape, thus resulting in being even more costly to the Government in the long run.
As I have just got back into employment this doesn't affect me directly any more, but having a VERY up to date viewpoint of what it's like to be on these benefits (today would have been my fortnightly signing day. I signed off last week, so it's that recent), I know the problems currently encountered by those on benefits, and far from the impression that David Cameron would have you believe that there is plenty of work out there for anyone prepared to get off their backsides & do something, and that anyone on benefits is simply staying on there because they're too bone idle & couldn't be bothered to work couldn't be further from the truth. Of course, there ARE those like that, but these are the ones who even if they were made to attend an interview they wouldn't be putting any effort into getting the job - in fact quite the opposite, thus wasting everybody's time. The vast majority, however DO want work, but the constant austerity cuts to those who can least afford it are making it harder & harder to even put themselves into a position where they can present themselves as a viable candidate. Given the choice of being able to put food on the table or saving up, so as to afford an Interview Suit (which might not even get a chance to be used), I'm sure you can see what the choice is going to be.
Being on benefits is hard enough as it is. Not only financially, but to the morale as well. It is soul destroying, especially when you know that there are those who have been lucky enough never to have experienced it who believe all the crap about claimants only being on benefits because they want to.
One of the main things required to finding employment is a sense of Personal Pride, and this can never be achieved while having to rely on Food Stamps & Food Banks to get by on a Daily Hand to Mouth basis, with no prospect of planning for the future.
If you agree, please consider signing the petition.
PrePayment Benefit Cards
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Oscar Namechange
- Posts: 31840
- Joined: Wed Jul 30, 2008 9:26 am
PrePayment Benefit Cards
I remember my local Tories talking about this In 2009.
There are two sides to this.
Unfortunately, there are people who abuse the benefit system. My revolting neighbour Is one. £4,000 rent arrears, £4,000 Council tax arrears. £2,000 Water Rates arrears etc.
This was due to the time she was paid all benefit herself Instead of It being paid direct to the authorities.
Every night on Facebook, she Is posting pictures of what they have just bought... things a pensioner would take years to save up for. She Is In the local pub 3 nights a week, buys weed, smokes and drinks and runs a car along with new regular tattoo's while her babies are under fed and grubby.
I remember when I came back from a Tory social evening In 2009 and told her of Tory Idea for food stamps and she was absolutely mortified.
On the other side of the coin, I don't see why those who manage their benefit sensibly should be penalised because of the likes of her and a few of her Ilk.
There are two sides to this.
Unfortunately, there are people who abuse the benefit system. My revolting neighbour Is one. £4,000 rent arrears, £4,000 Council tax arrears. £2,000 Water Rates arrears etc.
This was due to the time she was paid all benefit herself Instead of It being paid direct to the authorities.
Every night on Facebook, she Is posting pictures of what they have just bought... things a pensioner would take years to save up for. She Is In the local pub 3 nights a week, buys weed, smokes and drinks and runs a car along with new regular tattoo's while her babies are under fed and grubby.
I remember when I came back from a Tory social evening In 2009 and told her of Tory Idea for food stamps and she was absolutely mortified.
On the other side of the coin, I don't see why those who manage their benefit sensibly should be penalised because of the likes of her and a few of her Ilk.
At the going down of the sun and in the morning, we will remember them. R.L. Binyon
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Betty Boop
- Posts: 16987
- Joined: Sun Mar 27, 2005 1:17 pm
- Location: The end of the World
PrePayment Benefit Cards
I don't see why we should all be tarred. My children are fed, some weeks extremely cheaply due to having to pay bills or put money aside to save up for instance for a broken washing machine or just because I paid a utility bill. For instance would my local greengrocer accept it, I buy all my fresh produce from there because I like to support local shops and in turn our local farmers. It's a constant juggle without being told where I can and cannot spend my cash.
I've signed the petition.
I've signed the petition.
PrePayment Benefit Cards
I think it's a lousy idea and would be a nightmare to set up and administer. I too believe it's a sanction against the majority of claimants because of the actions of a few.
And, if I have too many weeks like the last one, I might have to ask for help with my rent in the not too distant future...a nasty tummy bug laid me low so I had to cancel my cleaning jobs...no cleaning, no money earned.
And, if I have too many weeks like the last one, I might have to ask for help with my rent in the not too distant future...a nasty tummy bug laid me low so I had to cancel my cleaning jobs...no cleaning, no money earned.
Live the questions now. Perhaps you will then gradually, without noticing it, live along some distant day into the answers...Rainer Maria Rilke
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Betty Boop
- Posts: 16987
- Joined: Sun Mar 27, 2005 1:17 pm
- Location: The end of the World
PrePayment Benefit Cards
theia;1465576 wrote: I think it's a lousy idea and would be a nightmare to set up and administer. I too believe it's a sanction against the majority of claimants because of the actions of a few.
And, if I have too many weeks like the last one, I might have to ask for help with my rent in the not too distant future...a nasty tummy bug laid me low so I had to cancel my cleaning jobs...no cleaning, no money earned.
I wonder how many children would go hungry whilst they try to set up the computer system to dole out these cards and all the teething problems that would ensue.
You should be able to find out online if you are entitled to claim anything. I read this within the last half hour too, quite shocking that the number of claimants has doubled since 2008!
Working poor: 1 in 4 people on housing benefit are in work - Mirror Online
And, if I have too many weeks like the last one, I might have to ask for help with my rent in the not too distant future...a nasty tummy bug laid me low so I had to cancel my cleaning jobs...no cleaning, no money earned.
I wonder how many children would go hungry whilst they try to set up the computer system to dole out these cards and all the teething problems that would ensue.
You should be able to find out online if you are entitled to claim anything. I read this within the last half hour too, quite shocking that the number of claimants has doubled since 2008!
Working poor: 1 in 4 people on housing benefit are in work - Mirror Online
PrePayment Benefit Cards
Betty Boop;1465578 wrote: I wonder how many children would go hungry whilst they try to set up the computer system to dole out these cards and all the teething problems that would ensue.
You should be able to find out online if you are entitled to claim anything. I read this within the last half hour too, quite shocking that the number of claimants has doubled since 2008!
Working poor: 1 in 4 people on housing benefit are in work - Mirror Online
My children have already checked it out and, yes, I am entitled to claim help...pension credit and housing benefit. But my current take on it is that whilst I'm able to work, I'd prefer to support myself. I just need to avoid nasty tummy bugs and the like!
You should be able to find out online if you are entitled to claim anything. I read this within the last half hour too, quite shocking that the number of claimants has doubled since 2008!
Working poor: 1 in 4 people on housing benefit are in work - Mirror Online
My children have already checked it out and, yes, I am entitled to claim help...pension credit and housing benefit. But my current take on it is that whilst I'm able to work, I'd prefer to support myself. I just need to avoid nasty tummy bugs and the like!
Live the questions now. Perhaps you will then gradually, without noticing it, live along some distant day into the answers...Rainer Maria Rilke
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Betty Boop
- Posts: 16987
- Joined: Sun Mar 27, 2005 1:17 pm
- Location: The end of the World
PrePayment Benefit Cards
theia;1465579 wrote: My children have already checked it out and, yes, I am entitled to claim help...pension credit and housing benefit. But my current take on it is that whilst I'm able to work, I'd prefer to support myself. I just need to avoid nasty tummy bugs and the like!
Hope you are feeling better, nothing worse than a tummy bug!
Hope you are feeling better, nothing worse than a tummy bug!
PrePayment Benefit Cards
Betty Boop;1465580 wrote: Hope you are feeling better, nothing worse than a tummy bug!
Gradually, yes, thanks. Not eating much but I'm on the mend.
Gradually, yes, thanks. Not eating much but I'm on the mend.
Live the questions now. Perhaps you will then gradually, without noticing it, live along some distant day into the answers...Rainer Maria Rilke
PrePayment Benefit Cards
The sad truth is that there are many different types of people, many do work the system, knowing all their 'rights' knowing what they can claim and when.
Let me put forward an alternative suggestion, that long term claimants receive Tokens, maybe after two years continuous on benefits, leaving the new or short term claimants as now.
Let me put forward an alternative suggestion, that long term claimants receive Tokens, maybe after two years continuous on benefits, leaving the new or short term claimants as now.
I thought I knew more than this until I opened my mouth
PrePayment Benefit Cards
Betty Boop;1465580 wrote: Hope you are feeling better, nothing worse than a tummy bug!
I thought that was a paper cut.
I thought that was a paper cut.
I thought I knew more than this until I opened my mouth
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Betty Boop
- Posts: 16987
- Joined: Sun Mar 27, 2005 1:17 pm
- Location: The end of the World
PrePayment Benefit Cards
Bruv;1465584 wrote: I thought that was a paper cut.
Or maybe a cymbal slicing through your big toe and needing three stitches (according to my daughter)
Or maybe a cymbal slicing through your big toe and needing three stitches (according to my daughter)
PrePayment Benefit Cards
Oscar Namechange;1465558 wrote: I remember my local Tories talking about this In 2009.
There are two sides to this.
Unfortunately, there are people who abuse the benefit system. My revolting neighbour Is one. £4,000 rent arrears, £4,000 Council tax arrears. £2,000 Water Rates arrears etc.
This was due to the time she was paid all benefit herself Instead of It being paid direct to the authorities.
Every night on Facebook, she Is posting pictures of what they have just bought... things a pensioner would take years to save up for. She Is In the local pub 3 nights a week, buys weed, smokes and drinks and runs a car along with new regular tattoo's while her babies are under fed and grubby.
I remember when I came back from a Tory social evening In 2009 and told her of Tory Idea for food stamps and she was absolutely mortified.
On the other side of the coin, I don't see why those who manage their benefit sensibly should be penalised because of the likes of her and a few of her Ilk.
Absolutely. There are those who will milk the system regardless, and it has to be said that they have to be very skilled in their own way in knowing how to find all the loopholes in order to do this, but the vast majority are nothing like that. It's only the minority that gets brought to the public eye.
As for the other suggestion of only giving them to longer term unemployed, that much is even worse. With unemployment, as I know from bitter experience, the longer you are out of work, the harder it gets to get out of the circle. I was put onto Incapacity Benefit for 12 years (I didn't put in for it - the DWP PUT me on it), then last year they changed all the rules & took me off it, putting me back onto Job Seekers, ergo something like 14 years unemployed.
Whilst on Incapacity Benefit I had just enough to get by on, and by managing my budget carefully was able to put a little aside for a rainy day from what was deemed to be the "Minimum Amount That The Law Says You Need To Live On". Then, when I was moved to JSA, the amount suddenly became £10 a week less, to another "Legal Minium You Need To Live On". Not much, you might think, as a basic figure, but if you look at it in terms of a percentage, it's a different matter. In the following period, despite a careful management of my budget I still found myself having to regularly dip into my 'Rainy Day' savings, taking them down from about £2500, to its present £140. Inflation is constantly on the increase & having a drastic cut in income is just not viable. Food Stamps would only result in making it even more difficult in making ends meet. Once again, further cutbacks at the expense of those who can least afford it in order to give tax cuts to those who can.
It makes it easy to understand why so many turn to crime.
When I do my shopping I shop around for the best deals. If this were to be done using the Food Stamp principle, not all stores would be accepting them, and I would therefore have to miss out on those cheaper prices.
Having finally found a job, I am happy to say I am out of that circle, but each experience I've had gives me an in depth understanding of the reality of the situation - which is partly how I got the job in the first place. The company I now work for deals with the same sort of Work Programme that I've been on, only dealing with Young People & Juvenile Offenders, so I can relate to the ones I'll be dealing with.
Incidentally, I received an update regarding the petition which, unfortunately, I've since deleted as it didn't seem relevant to me at the time, but as Betty has also signed the petition, maybe she has a copy. It refers to that the MP in Brent has been in touch with 38 Degrees stating that she would like to take it further, but that in order to do so then someone in her constituency would need to contact her about it, and therefore asking that if anyone is in this constituency, or knows of anyone there to contact her direct.
Betty - if you have a copy of that email could you paste it.
Another interesting article from the Guardian about it.
'Welfare cash cards' are much more than a tool of state control | Claudia Wood | Society | The Guardian
There are two sides to this.
Unfortunately, there are people who abuse the benefit system. My revolting neighbour Is one. £4,000 rent arrears, £4,000 Council tax arrears. £2,000 Water Rates arrears etc.
This was due to the time she was paid all benefit herself Instead of It being paid direct to the authorities.
Every night on Facebook, she Is posting pictures of what they have just bought... things a pensioner would take years to save up for. She Is In the local pub 3 nights a week, buys weed, smokes and drinks and runs a car along with new regular tattoo's while her babies are under fed and grubby.
I remember when I came back from a Tory social evening In 2009 and told her of Tory Idea for food stamps and she was absolutely mortified.
On the other side of the coin, I don't see why those who manage their benefit sensibly should be penalised because of the likes of her and a few of her Ilk.
Absolutely. There are those who will milk the system regardless, and it has to be said that they have to be very skilled in their own way in knowing how to find all the loopholes in order to do this, but the vast majority are nothing like that. It's only the minority that gets brought to the public eye.
As for the other suggestion of only giving them to longer term unemployed, that much is even worse. With unemployment, as I know from bitter experience, the longer you are out of work, the harder it gets to get out of the circle. I was put onto Incapacity Benefit for 12 years (I didn't put in for it - the DWP PUT me on it), then last year they changed all the rules & took me off it, putting me back onto Job Seekers, ergo something like 14 years unemployed.
Whilst on Incapacity Benefit I had just enough to get by on, and by managing my budget carefully was able to put a little aside for a rainy day from what was deemed to be the "Minimum Amount That The Law Says You Need To Live On". Then, when I was moved to JSA, the amount suddenly became £10 a week less, to another "Legal Minium You Need To Live On". Not much, you might think, as a basic figure, but if you look at it in terms of a percentage, it's a different matter. In the following period, despite a careful management of my budget I still found myself having to regularly dip into my 'Rainy Day' savings, taking them down from about £2500, to its present £140. Inflation is constantly on the increase & having a drastic cut in income is just not viable. Food Stamps would only result in making it even more difficult in making ends meet. Once again, further cutbacks at the expense of those who can least afford it in order to give tax cuts to those who can.
It makes it easy to understand why so many turn to crime.
When I do my shopping I shop around for the best deals. If this were to be done using the Food Stamp principle, not all stores would be accepting them, and I would therefore have to miss out on those cheaper prices.
Having finally found a job, I am happy to say I am out of that circle, but each experience I've had gives me an in depth understanding of the reality of the situation - which is partly how I got the job in the first place. The company I now work for deals with the same sort of Work Programme that I've been on, only dealing with Young People & Juvenile Offenders, so I can relate to the ones I'll be dealing with.
Incidentally, I received an update regarding the petition which, unfortunately, I've since deleted as it didn't seem relevant to me at the time, but as Betty has also signed the petition, maybe she has a copy. It refers to that the MP in Brent has been in touch with 38 Degrees stating that she would like to take it further, but that in order to do so then someone in her constituency would need to contact her about it, and therefore asking that if anyone is in this constituency, or knows of anyone there to contact her direct.
Betty - if you have a copy of that email could you paste it.
Another interesting article from the Guardian about it.
'Welfare cash cards' are much more than a tool of state control | Claudia Wood | Society | The Guardian
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Betty Boop
- Posts: 16987
- Joined: Sun Mar 27, 2005 1:17 pm
- Location: The end of the World
PrePayment Benefit Cards
Here it is
Hello again,
We have 31,349 signatures now - it's looking good
Question - do any of you live in Brent, or do you know someone who does? Because someone has received a reply from MP Sarah Teather, who says that she would like to raise the issue in Parliament; for that to happen, she needs to hear from a Brent constituent, to start the ball rolling.
Another thing - I've been advised that we need to contact as many Labour and Lib Dem MPs as possible, plus Child Poverty Action Group, bishops and anybody else who you think would be interested. I wrote to my own Labour MP, via the WriteToThem website, a few days ago and I am awaiting a response.
Keep it up, people - together we will make the powers that be sit up and listen!
Have a great weekend everyone
https://you.38degrees.org.uk/petitions/ ... efit-cards
Regards
Llewelyn LaVista
Hello again,
We have 31,349 signatures now - it's looking good
Question - do any of you live in Brent, or do you know someone who does? Because someone has received a reply from MP Sarah Teather, who says that she would like to raise the issue in Parliament; for that to happen, she needs to hear from a Brent constituent, to start the ball rolling.
Another thing - I've been advised that we need to contact as many Labour and Lib Dem MPs as possible, plus Child Poverty Action Group, bishops and anybody else who you think would be interested. I wrote to my own Labour MP, via the WriteToThem website, a few days ago and I am awaiting a response.
Keep it up, people - together we will make the powers that be sit up and listen!
Have a great weekend everyone
https://you.38degrees.org.uk/petitions/ ... efit-cards
Regards
Llewelyn LaVista
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Oscar Namechange
- Posts: 31840
- Joined: Wed Jul 30, 2008 9:26 am
PrePayment Benefit Cards
The sad truth about this, Is that those like my revolting neighbour will always find a way of getting cash for those vouchers and the end result will still see her children grubby and underfed.
At the going down of the sun and in the morning, we will remember them. R.L. Binyon
PrePayment Benefit Cards
Betty Boop;1465602 wrote: Here it is
Thanks Betty. That's the one.
Oscar - can I possibly ask that you also support this among your members? Party politics aside, I think we both agree that this is morally wrong.
Thanks Betty. That's the one.
Oscar - can I possibly ask that you also support this among your members? Party politics aside, I think we both agree that this is morally wrong.
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Oscar Namechange
- Posts: 31840
- Joined: Wed Jul 30, 2008 9:26 am
PrePayment Benefit Cards
FourPart;1465610 wrote: Thanks Betty. That's the one.
Oscar - can I possibly ask that you also support this among your members? Party politics aside, I think we both agree that this is morally wrong. Just for you Sweetcheeks, I'll put It on the Agenda for the next meeting and report back on their feedback...
Oscar - can I possibly ask that you also support this among your members? Party politics aside, I think we both agree that this is morally wrong. Just for you Sweetcheeks, I'll put It on the Agenda for the next meeting and report back on their feedback...
At the going down of the sun and in the morning, we will remember them. R.L. Binyon
PrePayment Benefit Cards
Thank you. Much appreciated
:-)
:-)
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Oscar Namechange
- Posts: 31840
- Joined: Wed Jul 30, 2008 9:26 am
PrePayment Benefit Cards
FourPart;1465614 wrote: Thank you. Much appreciated
:-)
I've just put the link on a combined Nationalist site... should get a few votes.
:-)
I've just put the link on a combined Nationalist site... should get a few votes.
At the going down of the sun and in the morning, we will remember them. R.L. Binyon
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Peter Lake
- Posts: 1031
- Joined: Mon Jul 21, 2008 2:02 pm
PrePayment Benefit Cards
Have i just got this right? The member here who slates Oscar and slates the B.N.P. at every turn, now wants and asks Oscar to raise a petition with her members, the very people he so despises ? Good heavens.
None the less, the idea of food tokens is discrimination. They will be putting people in an impossible situation where they are left unable to save up for emergencies and such things as the car having it's M.O.T. This is nothing more than an attempt to divide class, the very class divisions that some politicians have worked to end.
None the less, the idea of food tokens is discrimination. They will be putting people in an impossible situation where they are left unable to save up for emergencies and such things as the car having it's M.O.T. This is nothing more than an attempt to divide class, the very class divisions that some politicians have worked to end.
PrePayment Benefit Cards
Put quite simply I see this as a cross party issue. Yes, we are poles apart on our political views, and we both accept that, but I think we both agree that there are certain issues where our opinions concur, and I believe this is one of those times.
Furthermore, believe it or not, if there were a petition to ban the BNP I wouldn't sign it as I am of the view that despite its politics being in total conflict to my own, it is the nature of Democracy that everyone has the right to express their opinion, no matter how much you may detest it.
Furthermore, believe it or not, if there were a petition to ban the BNP I wouldn't sign it as I am of the view that despite its politics being in total conflict to my own, it is the nature of Democracy that everyone has the right to express their opinion, no matter how much you may detest it.
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Oscar Namechange
- Posts: 31840
- Joined: Wed Jul 30, 2008 9:26 am
PrePayment Benefit Cards
FourPart;1465668 wrote:
Furthermore, believe it or not, if there were a petition to ban the BNP I wouldn't sign it as I am of the view that despite its politics being in total conflict to my own, it is the nature of Democracy that everyone has the right to express their opinion, no matter how much you may detest it.
There has been and Is...
To ban the existance of The EDL and BNP - e-petitions
Ban the BNP - e-petitions
Ban The BNP
As you'll see, Government must have been absolutely swamped by the numbers......... err not
I got more Sigs than that when I called for David Dickinson to be deported despite being English.
Furthermore, believe it or not, if there were a petition to ban the BNP I wouldn't sign it as I am of the view that despite its politics being in total conflict to my own, it is the nature of Democracy that everyone has the right to express their opinion, no matter how much you may detest it.
There has been and Is...
To ban the existance of The EDL and BNP - e-petitions
Ban the BNP - e-petitions
Ban The BNP
As you'll see, Government must have been absolutely swamped by the numbers......... err not
I got more Sigs than that when I called for David Dickinson to be deported despite being English.
At the going down of the sun and in the morning, we will remember them. R.L. Binyon
PrePayment Benefit Cards
Oscar Namechange;1465676 wrote:
I got more Sigs than that when I called for David Dickinson to be deported despite being English.
Well, he is coloured.
I got more Sigs than that when I called for David Dickinson to be deported despite being English.
Well, he is coloured.
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Oscar Namechange
- Posts: 31840
- Joined: Wed Jul 30, 2008 9:26 am
PrePayment Benefit Cards
FourPart;1465679 wrote: Well, he is coloured. :yh_rotfl:yh_rotfl:yh_rotfl
Yeah.. Orange
What a knob
:yh_rotfl:yh_rotfl:yh_rotflYeah.. Orange
What a knob
At the going down of the sun and in the morning, we will remember them. R.L. Binyon