Those Chinese !

Nomad · Post by **Nomad** » Sat Aug 23, 2008 4:41 am

By Harvey Araton Published: August 13, 2008

BEIJING: The simmering issue over possibly under-age Chinese gymnasts did not seem to boil over before the women's (wink, wink) team final was to be settled Wednesday and with the host country in the way of a United States gold medal. But why do I get the feeling that if these Olympics were happening in Chicago or Los Angeles, the story would by now be a serious cable television cause célèbre?

Larry King would be interviewing the stricken parents of victimized Americans. Hannity would be chiding Colmes about Communist child abusers. Lou Dobbs would be demanding the borders be closed to all Chinese gymnasts under 80 pounds.

Here, claims by the coaching legend Bela Karolyi that what China has done is "a slap in the face of the whole world" have barely resonated outside the gymnastic venue and across the greater Olympic community. Opponents have been loath to complain and even his wife, Martha, the American team coordinator, hasn't publicly made a big deal of it.

The international gymnastic governing body known as the FIG said it was satisfied with the Chinese gymnasts' documentation, despite reports suggesting three of the mites might be under the required age of 16. The International Olympic Committee, so heavily invested in a Games that China can be proud of, apparently does not want to know about the admission of a former Chinese gymnast who reportedly has claimed to have competed as a 14-year-old at the 2000 Sydney Games.

Mind you, this is the same IOC that responded with the speed and urgency of Michael Phelps kicking off the wall to murky allegations of figure skating cheating in Salt Lake City's Winter Games six years ago by changing an official result in the pairs event to essentially douse a resulting news media firestorm.

When in North America, do as the North Americans do (overreact). When in China, overlook.

For better or worse, these are the shrug-and-don't-tell Olympics, undoubtedly because it would be considered impolitic to embarrass the Chinese after they went to such great expense to throw the world this lavish party.

If Internet access is sketchy, work around it. If the American speedskater and activist Joey Cheek's visa is revoked on the eve of the Games, get over it. If there is evidence against Chinese gymnasts beyond the usual Olympic suspicions, don't believe it.

Based on his credentials as a father and a (biased) commentator (for NBC), Bela Karolyi scoffed at the party line, recently saying he knows what a 16-year-old looks like. Stretching the point, he suggested the Chinese gymnasts looked more like "they are 7 and maybe still in diapers."

As a father myself, I have never come across a 7-year-old not yet potty-trained. But I do know one thing about adolescent girls — they often are fully grown faster than boys. Deng Linlin, the smallest of the Chinese gymnasts, said to be 16, is 4 feet 6 inches, 68 pounds. On average, they are 3 ½ inches smaller and 30 pounds lighter than the Americans. There are many little people in the world, but some of them do not look like teenagers.

Are the Chinese under age or — like other gymnasts from other countries through the years — strategically undernourished (which strikes me as worse than forging a few documents, in the grand scheme of things)?

Viewers tend to put the seamier side of this sport out of their minds every four years because it is so athletic and theatrical — the girl next door meets Cirque du Soleil. But it did occur to me that the Americans had the look of young ladies when I made the interview rounds during a pre-Olympics media summit in Chicago last April, hardly a squeaky voice among the lot. The smallest American — in fact, the only one under 5 feet — is the 16-year-old Shawn Johnson, at 4-9, 90 pounds.

Compared with the Chinese, they are the Green Bay Packers. With all that height and bulk, they somehow managed to win last year's world championships and came to Beijing a confident bunch, as evidenced by Samantha Peszek's golden fingernails. But the best-polished plans can snap with one misstep. In the warm-up of Sunday's qualifying, Peszek tweaked her left ankle, adding to an earlier rash of injuries.

In the qualifying, the Americans placed second to the Chinese, who went into the final at full strength and with a home-country advantage.

Their fans were cheering, while no one of Olympic import was interested in claims of cheating.

Bez · Post by **Bez** » Sat Aug 23, 2008 4:42 am

Barman;960602 wrote: There was a programme on the box tonight spot, quite upsetting to watch, these kids were lined up in their hundreds, taken from their families to perform because they showed talent. Some of these kids were hardly out of nappies and they were shown performing, amazingly well on all sorts of apparatus, a disgrace.

This subject is hard to debate by us 'westerners' but when you live in abject poverty any parent would grab a chance for their children to have a better life.

More fortunate Chinese are like Indians and Phillipinos etc who send money home to their families to provide a better standard of living and education.

In my opinion, we should be very careful about condemning cultures that we don't fully understand just because they are 'different'.

I am more outraged about parents in the western world who push their very young children into modelling, acting, beauty contests just to fulfill their own dreams.

Bez · Post by **Bez** » Sat Aug 23, 2008 4:49 am

It's not that many years ago that Eastern European countries were giving drugs to their girl gymnasts to STUNT their growth .

Nomad · Post by **Nomad** » Sat Aug 23, 2008 4:51 am

Bez;960950 wrote: It's not that many years ago that Eastern European countries were giving drugs to their girl gymnasts to STUNT their growth .

Oh God I was watching a show on East Berliner Olympians back in the 80's

Shes a he now and the rest of those athletes are all screwed up.

Accountable · Post by **Accountable** » Sat Aug 23, 2008 4:53 am

Bez;960941 wrote: This subject is hard to debate by us 'westerners' but when you live in abject poverty any parent would grab a chance for their children to have a better life.

More fortunate Chinese are like Indians and Phillipinos etc who send money home to their families to provide a better standard of living and education.

In my opinion, we should be very careful about condemning cultures that we don't fully understand just because they are 'different'.

I am more outraged about parents in the western world who push their very young children into modelling, acting, beauty contests just to fulfill their own dreams.It's not always "just to fulfill their own dreams." Sometimes it's to fulfill their own dreams ... and get rich!

Bez · Post by **Bez** » Sat Aug 23, 2008 4:54 am

Nomad;960952 wrote: Oh God I was watching a show on East Berliner Olympians back in the 80's

Shes a he now and the rest of those athletes are all screwed up.

Sad to see what people will do to be winners.....

Post by **spot** » Sat Aug 23, 2008 5:00 am

Bez;960941 wrote: This subject is hard to debate by us 'westerners' but when you live in abject poverty any parent would grab a chance for their children to have a better life.I'm one of the parents who said no when asked to put my girl into the British 10+ accelerated gymnast program but I was one of the few of those who were offered the chance who declined it. It struck me at the time that a fair few of the parents were the ones pushing their children to go higher. I don't think abject poverty came into it.

The op-ed piece is interesting, Nomie, but it doesn't have evidence of Chinese trainers confiscating three year olds from their families which is what the barman and I were disputing.

Nomad · Post by **Nomad** » Sat Aug 23, 2008 5:13 am

spot;960959 wrote: I'm one of the parents who said no when asked to put my girl into the British 10+ accelerated gymnast program but I was one of the few of those who were offered the chance who declined it. It struck me at the time that a fair few of the parents were the ones pushing their children to go higher. I don't think abject poverty came into it.

The op-ed piece is interesting, Nomie, but it doesn't have evidence of Chinese trainers confiscating three year olds from their families which is what the barman and I were disputing.

No but this wont go away until an investigation has been completed.

So we wait.

I hope its not true.

Concerning Bezzies tolerance on poverty stricken families, as an idealist I still like to think of the Olymipcs as a stage for purity and goodness.

I tear when the athletes recieve their award for excellence and the monetary awards will follow. Its just dirty when and if they cheat.

Theres no reward in that.

Bez · Post by **Bez** » Sat Aug 23, 2008 6:23 am

Nomad;960965 wrote: No but this wont go away until an investigation has been completed.

So we wait.

I hope its not true.

Concerning Bezzies tolerance on poverty stricken families, as an idealist I still like to think of the Olymipcs as a stage for purity and goodness.

I tear when the athletes recieve their award for excellence and the monetary awards will follow. Its just dirty when and if they cheat.

Theres no reward in that.

Me too....i wholeheartedly dislike cheats.....my point was that people in abject poverty in India, Africa, China , some South American countries etc do desperate things under desperate circumstances. How can we appreciate the other side of life when we sit in comfort in front of our computers having this discussion..... some people are too quick to judge in my opinion.

Bez · Post by **Bez** » Sat Aug 23, 2008 6:26 am

So......... this little girl from China was still outstanding whatever her age.....The 'team' may have cheated but she was fantastic.....you can't take that away from her.

Nomad · Post by **Nomad** » Sat Aug 23, 2008 7:08 am

Bez;961027 wrote: Me too....i wholeheartedly dislike cheats.....my point was that people in abject poverty in India, Africa, China , some South American countries etc do desperate things under desperate circumstances. How can we appreciate the other side of life when we sit in comfort in front of our computers having this discussion..... some people are too quick to judge in my opinion.

I can appreciate your sentiment however from a societal stand point there must be standards.

They may have their reasons but a cheat is still a cheat.

How can someone who gains dishonestly lavish in rewards ill gotten ?

And how can someone steal the prize from another and enjoy it ?

Its like stealing a trophy, what good is it if you didnt earn it ?

Bez · Post by **Bez** » Sat Aug 23, 2008 9:34 am

Nomad;961070 wrote: I can appreciate your sentiment however from a societal stand point there must be standards.

They may have their reasons but a cheat is still a cheat.

How can someone who gains dishonestly lavish in rewards ill gotten ?

And how can someone steal the prize from another and enjoy it ?

Its like stealing a trophy, what good is it if you didnt earn it ?

Define 'CHEAT' then !

Post by **spot** » Fri Oct 03, 2008 5:32 pm

Nomad;960965 wrote: No but this wont go away until an investigation has been completed.

So we wait.

I hope its not true.

Concerning Bezzies tolerance on poverty stricken families, as an idealist I still like to think of the Olymipcs as a stage for purity and goodness.

I tear when the athletes recieve their award for excellence and the monetary awards will follow. Its just dirty when and if they cheat.

Theres no reward in that.

It took a while for FIG to fully investigate but they've now produced their final report.The gymnastics world governing body "has completed its investigation into the ages of Chinese team gymnasts who competed at the 2008 Beijing Olympic Games", FIG said in the statement posted Wednesday on its official website www.fig-gymnastics.com.

"The FIG has shared its conclusions with the International Olympic Committee (IOC), which originally requested the inquiry. It is considered that the case is now concluded," FIG said in the statement. "Originals of official documents received from the Chinese Gymnastics Association, specifically passports, identity cards and family booklets or 'Household Registers', confirm the ages of the athletes," said the statement.

After the Chinese women gymnasts harvested the Olympic team gold in Beijing, media rumors spread out claiming that the hosts have fielded ineligible athletes, as gymnasts must turn 16 in the year of an Olympics to take part. Thus, the FIG had asked the Chinese gymnastics federation to submit documents proving the birth dates of five members of the gold medal-winning team, namely He Kexin, Jiang Yuyuan, Li Shanshan, Deng Linlin and Yang Yilin. And the IOC also specifically asked the FIG to investigate double Olympic gold-medallist He, who was registered as 16 while rumors suggested she may have been 14. He also won the uneven bars title with a tiebreak rule against American Nastia Liukin.

During the 2008 Beijing Olympics where the hosts collected nine of the 14 gold medals up for grabs in the artistic gymnastics, Chinese coaches and gymnasts had kept saying that any discrepancies were either Web site inaccuracies or paperwork errors, but their explanation still failed to stop the rumors. On FIG's statement, Liukin said she was pleased with the level of scrutiny given to the issue. "When the questions arose originally in the press all anyone in the gymnastics and Olympic communities wanted was closure which we now have," Liukin said in a statement. "Again, I congratulate my competitors from China and look forward to using my successes to help others," said the American gymnast.

http://news.xinhuanet.com/english/2008- ... 141017.htm